The main heroes in the Khakas epic stories were often women, which reflected their higher status in the society. Mr Timur B. Davletov, the Ankara-based sociologist, explains the diminishing of the women's influence among the Khakas as a result of the monotheist religions' impact.
Listen to exept from Khan Mirgen as told by late Anna Khurgijekova
kultur-multur.org: What is this epos about? Is it about the King the Hunter?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, in Kyrgyz (ed: as in Khakas) language “Khan” is a king and “Mergen” is a hunter. As we know from literary sources, the name of the “Khakas” people originated from a pronounciation of the ethnonym "Kyrgyz" in ancient Chinese,” only without the letter “r.”
There are only 5114 lines in this epos. According to my research, the epos is 1500 years old and comes from the period of the Enisey Kyrgyz. However, some parts indicate that it may have even more distant roots.
The epos narrates the lives of three generations of heroes, which is traditional for such oral pieces of art. The narrator was Anna Khurgijekova, one of the most famous narrators - “khaidjy.” She was born in the year 1918 and left our world in 1990. Up until now the epos has not been translated into any language.
In “Khan the Hunter,” the heroes protect their people, reign over them and pursue a just
social policy. Being a sociologist, the epos interests me because I can study the socio-
cultural life of our predecessors.
For example, in Khakas tales there are many instances where the main protagonist is a woman heroin. This reflects the realities of ancient Turkic shamanism. In “Khan the Hunter” the main protagonist is not a woman, nevertheless we can see how women actively participate in the life of the society. This motif runs through the whole fabric of the hero’s tale. These women are mothers, brides, girlfriends of heroes, who do not necessarily get married. These women do have a say in matters.
I would like to make a small comparison here. Later, under the influence of monotheistic religions, the role of women drops to a secondary plane. The Khakas people, or course, have retained their ancient believes, yet the monotheistic influence has not gone without trace. The fact that women in these tales appear as active actors in society proves again the ancient roots of these narrations.
In this respect, “Khan the Hunter” is of special interest to scholars who are involved in the research of the socio-cultural history of ancient Turkic people.
kultur-multur.org: How much is the epic narrative culture alive in modern Khakas?
Timur Davlet: As the famous orientalist and turkologist Radlov (Vasilii Vasileivich) once said, “only the Kyrgyz have a rich epic heritage.” This is backed up by facts. According to the researchers, the Khakas have more than 200 eposes. The majority of them are not researched nor published.
kultur-multur.org: It turns out you have more eposes than the Kyrgyz do. The Kyrgyz have around 50 only.
Timur Davlet: The Khakas narrations are from 1,500 to 30,000 lines long. In other words, they have not gone through such a process where many narrations intertwine into one volumous art piece, like the “Manas” epos of the Kyrgyz people. “Manas” has around 500 thousand lines.
On top of that, the narrative tradition of the Khakas, unfortunately, was disrupted during the Soviet rule. We have lost this pearl of oral cultural tradition.
kultur-multur.org: Slava Kuchenov, from the Khakas musical group “Sabjilar,” talks about having had the epic narrations come to him in his dreams. Are there other similar cases of revitalization of the tradition?
Timur B.Davletov: There are such instances and they are quite welcome. The issue is, there is an oral culture and there is the written tradition. There is a difference between them. In oral traditions, the narrator learns lines directly from the lips of other narrators.
kultur-multur.org: To become a narrator, it is also important to have a higher dream, isn’t?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, there is a spiritual side too. There is a conception among the Khakas that the khaidjy who have spirits, their oral performance, their virtuosity is perceived at a higher level (compared to those who have no spirits to support them).
Nowadays, traditions have changed. Today people learn not from mouth to mouth, they learn from writings, from texts. Researchers pertain that the actors of oral culture do not find it difficult to learn and remember a large amount of lines. For the modern man, who has gone through socialization in the cultural sphere surrounded by written tradition, it is difficult to learn and memorize several thousand lines from mouth to mouth. It is practically impossible for them, as it is impossible for a person from an oral tradition to learn even a small text in written form.
It is not a coincidence that in all the eposes there are repetitions, which for a modern western thinker might seem redundant. Yet, this was a special form for easing the memorization process of large amounts of lines in oral form.
But in practice, one does not stand in the way of the other. For example, for us, the Khakas narration is on the verge of extinction or almost lost. The revitalization of this art form comes through a written form, i.e. through the western thinking; this we have to consent to. If we concentrate our attention on the result, then the accepting the memorization of texts in written forms helps our goal of re-establishing our cultural heritage. In the last years of Soviet rule the narrations were written down and presented in books.
kultur-multur.org: As soon as the eposes were written down, they have begun to die out, haven’t they?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, unfortunately this genre is dying out. Yet, the culture has a tendency to constantly change, it is never static. Change is inevitable. This has positive as well as negative consequences. Culture cannot be frozen up to keep it unchanged.
kultur-multur.org: How are these eposes relevant to modern times?
Timur B.Davletov: They are relevant first of all in the socio-economic background. Heroes tell us that it is necessary to take care of the poor and of the old. At the same time they do not glorify poverty. The heroes pertain that it is important to dress well and to have a good horse. In other words, there has to be equality in sufficiency rather than in poverty. This is the difference in conception of social politics of ancient Turkic people and, for example, of the Bolsheviks.
Interview by Janyl Jusubjan
Translation by Jambulat Chytyrbaev
Ankara-Prague, February 2009
Listen to exept from Khan Mirgen as told by late Anna Khurgijekova
kultur-multur.org: What is this epos about? Is it about the King the Hunter?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, in Kyrgyz (ed: as in Khakas) language “Khan” is a king and “Mergen” is a hunter. As we know from literary sources, the name of the “Khakas” people originated from a pronounciation of the ethnonym "Kyrgyz" in ancient Chinese,” only without the letter “r.”
There are only 5114 lines in this epos. According to my research, the epos is 1500 years old and comes from the period of the Enisey Kyrgyz. However, some parts indicate that it may have even more distant roots.
The epos narrates the lives of three generations of heroes, which is traditional for such oral pieces of art. The narrator was Anna Khurgijekova, one of the most famous narrators - “khaidjy.” She was born in the year 1918 and left our world in 1990. Up until now the epos has not been translated into any language.
In “Khan the Hunter,” the heroes protect their people, reign over them and pursue a just
social policy. Being a sociologist, the epos interests me because I can study the socio-
cultural life of our predecessors.
For example, in Khakas tales there are many instances where the main protagonist is a woman heroin. This reflects the realities of ancient Turkic shamanism. In “Khan the Hunter” the main protagonist is not a woman, nevertheless we can see how women actively participate in the life of the society. This motif runs through the whole fabric of the hero’s tale. These women are mothers, brides, girlfriends of heroes, who do not necessarily get married. These women do have a say in matters.
I would like to make a small comparison here. Later, under the influence of monotheistic religions, the role of women drops to a secondary plane. The Khakas people, or course, have retained their ancient believes, yet the monotheistic influence has not gone without trace. The fact that women in these tales appear as active actors in society proves again the ancient roots of these narrations.
In this respect, “Khan the Hunter” is of special interest to scholars who are involved in the research of the socio-cultural history of ancient Turkic people.
kultur-multur.org: How much is the epic narrative culture alive in modern Khakas?
Timur Davlet: As the famous orientalist and turkologist Radlov (Vasilii Vasileivich) once said, “only the Kyrgyz have a rich epic heritage.” This is backed up by facts. According to the researchers, the Khakas have more than 200 eposes. The majority of them are not researched nor published.
kultur-multur.org: It turns out you have more eposes than the Kyrgyz do. The Kyrgyz have around 50 only.
Timur Davlet: The Khakas narrations are from 1,500 to 30,000 lines long. In other words, they have not gone through such a process where many narrations intertwine into one volumous art piece, like the “Manas” epos of the Kyrgyz people. “Manas” has around 500 thousand lines.
On top of that, the narrative tradition of the Khakas, unfortunately, was disrupted during the Soviet rule. We have lost this pearl of oral cultural tradition.
kultur-multur.org: Slava Kuchenov, from the Khakas musical group “Sabjilar,” talks about having had the epic narrations come to him in his dreams. Are there other similar cases of revitalization of the tradition?
Timur B.Davletov: There are such instances and they are quite welcome. The issue is, there is an oral culture and there is the written tradition. There is a difference between them. In oral traditions, the narrator learns lines directly from the lips of other narrators.
kultur-multur.org: To become a narrator, it is also important to have a higher dream, isn’t?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, there is a spiritual side too. There is a conception among the Khakas that the khaidjy who have spirits, their oral performance, their virtuosity is perceived at a higher level (compared to those who have no spirits to support them).
Nowadays, traditions have changed. Today people learn not from mouth to mouth, they learn from writings, from texts. Researchers pertain that the actors of oral culture do not find it difficult to learn and remember a large amount of lines. For the modern man, who has gone through socialization in the cultural sphere surrounded by written tradition, it is difficult to learn and memorize several thousand lines from mouth to mouth. It is practically impossible for them, as it is impossible for a person from an oral tradition to learn even a small text in written form.
It is not a coincidence that in all the eposes there are repetitions, which for a modern western thinker might seem redundant. Yet, this was a special form for easing the memorization process of large amounts of lines in oral form.
But in practice, one does not stand in the way of the other. For example, for us, the Khakas narration is on the verge of extinction or almost lost. The revitalization of this art form comes through a written form, i.e. through the western thinking; this we have to consent to. If we concentrate our attention on the result, then the accepting the memorization of texts in written forms helps our goal of re-establishing our cultural heritage. In the last years of Soviet rule the narrations were written down and presented in books.
kultur-multur.org: As soon as the eposes were written down, they have begun to die out, haven’t they?
Timur B.Davletov: Yes, unfortunately this genre is dying out. Yet, the culture has a tendency to constantly change, it is never static. Change is inevitable. This has positive as well as negative consequences. Culture cannot be frozen up to keep it unchanged.
kultur-multur.org: How are these eposes relevant to modern times?
Timur B.Davletov: They are relevant first of all in the socio-economic background. Heroes tell us that it is necessary to take care of the poor and of the old. At the same time they do not glorify poverty. The heroes pertain that it is important to dress well and to have a good horse. In other words, there has to be equality in sufficiency rather than in poverty. This is the difference in conception of social politics of ancient Turkic people and, for example, of the Bolsheviks.
Interview by Janyl Jusubjan
Translation by Jambulat Chytyrbaev
Ankara-Prague, February 2009
A Source of Reportage at http://kultur-multur.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=195&Itemid=2
